I appreciate your response, I am especially glad to hear that your mother has returned to the church. Baptists are not Protestants! If you think women ought to wear pants, thats your prerogative. Some have pointed to the Anabaptists as the examples of early Baptist churches. I would agree with this. I meant to say that I agree that the IFB has strict dress standards. He, however, continued to preach by holding services in his own home. I really have an issue with this point. And only imagination could describe what his mind and soul was experiencing. Any professed church that does not recognize these is Apsotasy & not the Church. That shows your lack of emotional maturity. Thousands of Southern Baptist Churches didn't baptize a single convert last year. He can make it without out $$$, but we need to learn to let go of it. I was able to better understand the New Testament. 71 N., De Queen, Arkansas 71832, United States of America DeQueen Flag Listing Claim This Listing Arbanna Baptist Church You will find, to the left, a tags cloud as well as a category drop down menu. The bulk of your comments were about the historical background of the Church of Christ movement. While I do agree that there are some things that tradition has failed on (i.e. Would someone be frowned upon if they used another translation of the bible in your church besides the KJV translation? But rather than ordaining ourselves mini-Holy Spirits we need to be faithful in our teaching, we need to teach repentance, and we need to leave the conviction of sin, righteousness and judgement to Almighty God. 2 Timothy 2:15, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. I would mostly be concerned about #1 more than any other. Anyhow he screamed through most of it (funny I never see Jesus screaming at folks, particularly His followers) told some fantastic tales, not saying he was lying, but, well you know what I mean. Thanks for any love shown but what you just did Kaatie was take a few lines I wrote and placed them within your own ideaand that is know as taking something out of context . However, let no one think little of the name of Baptist for it is the name that most has identified those individuals and churches who have uncompromisingly stood on the Word of God. A storm of persecution broke out because these Baptist preached what the Puritans called damnable errors. Most of the members of the church were fined or imprisoned or both, at one time or another. I think you are confusing ceremonial law with moral law. Robert Fry - Pastor of Bible Baptist Church in Plattsburgh, NY Deception; 75. I am not trying to be overly critical and yet I only have a certain amt of time to get to my points and while doing that I often come across that way, so forgive me. Here ar ethe key words: ought to have done without leaving the others undone, which would mean that tithing is good. Read More. All systems of hierarchy set up by man over the authority of the local church has lead to doctrinal errors and corruption without exception and God has not party with them. Even the enemies of the Baptists openly recognize their zeal for the Word of God. But this article simply exposes the Baptist system as just another denomination among tens of thousands. Thus, the name independent means that the church patterns itself after the New Testament example and stands alone under the authority of the Bible. As many theologians saywe can agree to disagree on some things but when it comes to the Fundamental of the Christian Faithbased on by the way what God says in the Word, then thats when one should draw the line b/c its no longer a matter of Christians in various fellowships & preferances that are allowable but then becomes a matter of even being a Christian at all (like Mormonisn, Jehovahs Wittness, Catholics, etc). There are no rules about what to give at all. Suppose an airplane flew over some isolated country that had no past or present contact with anyone else in the world. You seems to be as blind as the Pharisees. He said he could tell because I had a joyful spirit. 3:3). (See Acts 20:28, Hebrews 13:7). Knolleys after two years returned to England at the request of his father. About modesty, my wife and I attended a concert that my sons band performed at a teen group in a neighboring town. This is known as the Argumentum ad populum fallacy. Enter keyword. In Europe, Protestant churches are state churches and supported to some degree by government imposed taxes. Its is true that many Baptists left the ranks of Protestant churches which were doctrinal unsound and apostate. S.J. You either comply or you are thrown out. No one in USA at least (whether IFB, CALVARLY CHAPEL, MOST CHURCHES, etc) tithe on all belongings at they practiced thier & our money/wealth/argicultural exchange & system is very different. Like friends of my son who were in Mexico recently. He is much better at it than we are. The natural question then to ask is, What makes a person a true Baptist? In examining the history of Baptists and determining what makes up a genuine and true Baptist, five distinctives should be noted. I have transferred schools and since then Ive had to find a new church. The crime of these men was that they believed the Bible was Gods Truth, and rejected dictates of false churches and men. Im surprised but shouldnt be by now that folks know so very little about their respective churches/traditions, most just sit in the pew and simply repeat what their pastor has told them, never checking and studying for themselves, what thus saith the Lord You act so surprised that I questioned you about which Church of Christ you were referring to, do yourself alittle favor and have a look at wikipedias lists of Churches of Christ First and foremost I wanted to make sure you werent referring to the The Church of Christ of Latter Day Saints which is a flat-out cult. @bob Examine any church in light of these five distinctive it will be shown if they are true historical Baptist congregation which is synonymous with what is a true biblical New Testament church. 8.) You have it backwards. In 1906 there was a split with this group, some believing that there should be no musical instruments in the church (dont know where this got dreamed up, certainly didnt find it in the bible) This is when they started calling themselves the Churches of Christ. 2 Corinthians 9:6 Prosperity Giving Deception, 76. 10 Myths About the King James Version, 68. Really!! About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright . Believers are not set apart by the clothing they wear so much as their conduct, character, and lifestyle. Thats NOT in the Bible anywhere! Ive become weary of those labels, and the Baptist one carries alot of baggage now. After Henry VII separated England from the Roman Catholic Church the Baptist faired no better. We are looking for passionate defenders of the faith and offer a viable alternative to New Evangelical and compromising mission boards. My sons group will be performing on the Indie stage at 10:00 am on July 1. Fundamental Baptist use the name in its strictest sense as meaning holding to the fundamentals of the New Testament teachings without error. The only time I ever dressed up was for Job interviews. Member churches are forbidden to affiliate with any denomination, and the fellowship, administered by annually elected trustees, cannot . The true Independent Fundamental Baptists have no association or fellowship with these churches because they teach or practice things contrary to the New Testament. 14Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell. Proverbs 23:13-14 see how silly that way of using scripture is? There are a number of other wrong teachings w/in this church but the false teaching about baptism is far and away the biggest, some of the others are, not believing in eternal security, and close behind is not believing that one can know that you are saved. You know, when you really dig into many religions you find much of mans tradition. 4:1-5, 1 Cor. Listening To The Critics A Response To James Ach, 56. http://www.av1611.org/ this web site is dial-the-truth ministries, but I call them dial-the-. This was the best onemembers in our church raise hands, say amen, clap after special music (GASP! He did not fail to share truth although He was not yet crucifiedso likewise I argue that since He said it should not have been left undoneHe meant what He says as He shared the fuller meaning I believe of the Laws. Some Baptists such as the Landmark Baptist and those often referred to as One of the best sources I have found concerning His nature, the Nature of Jesus, and the Holy Spirit is at the following link: Gayle Erwin does a wonderful teaching on the nature of God. INDEPENDENT This simply means that the church stands alone, free of any governing denomination, convention or council. They have a 1st Amendment right to speak their mind, but that doesnt mean shouting down a preacher at a military funeral. Independent, Fundamental, King James, Mission Minded Our Service Times Are: Sunday Morning Worship -. The pastor is a self-taught, good man. What does the Bible say about the way Christians should dress? Adulterous generally hide their actions. http://www.wvec.com/news/local/INSIDE-A-NAKED-CHURCH-85062392.html. We give out of thankfulness to God for what Christ has accomplished as we are led by the Spirit. The grace economy is a much superior way to live a life pleasing to God. He began by baptizing himself and then baptizing ten other members. The Puritans were dissenters from the Church of England. That made them in the eyes of God as legitimate a church as any Paul founded. Sorry to tell you, but youve been deceived. Is it based on the individual church or whole congregations? The ordinance of baptism, or 2. Ive told bits and pieces of my story here over the last couple of years, so dont want to travel back through all of that, suffice it to say I left a very legalistic IFB, and now find myself in a tiny, new work that a friend started about 4 years ago (about 20 on Sunday) he calls it a Baptist church, I spoke to him about taking the baptist title out of it, but he wouldnt have it. You CANNOT be loving either if you are refusing to render unto the Lord that which is his, and this includes tithing. Christ suffered and gave His life to save you from hell, it's time you start going to a church that actually believes that. If the apostle Peter wanted to show up to Church one day while he was stripped and naked he would probably not be allowed in most Churches unless he put on some clothes. I am currently working on a research paper in seminary. Now I am in full agreement with you that we should support our places of worship with our monetary gifts, but a mandatory tithe for new testament christians? He preserved His word and the Word preserved a true Gospel witness during every moment of history since Pentecost. No words could console. Found you after all this time!!! Ok how about some peace Blessed are the peacemakers I apologize for my abrasive writing style and did not purposely write to offend you, but make no mistake, someone can be dunked until they know every minnow by name, but that doesnt make them saved. Off the top of my head, I can think of 7-8 divorced couples in our church right now (and we only have around 150 in regular attendance) Jesus statement to the Pharisees about tithing would not apply to you because you are not a Jew under the Mosaic Law. He strongly believed in separation of church and state and upheld the principles of soul liberty. He mentions a man named William Sawtre, who was identified as a Lollard and Baptist, was the first person burned at the stake after Henry IVs 1400 AD decree to burn heretics. Even though they may have been uner the law as you sayJesus did not cease sharing the fuller truth of the Law & stretching us to grasp the fullfillment of the Law. For example when Jesus said to not store up treasures on earth where they would persih but in HeavenI believe Hes refering to at least in part some Godly endeavors (that often take money)that we do for His namesake. Thank you for writing back. Thank you for your help! So what is the solution? Many Baptists were executed by the newly formed Church of England during what is called the Protestant inquisition. God alone has that authority and He in the person of the Holy Spirit brings conviction and salvation to those who in simple faith believe. 53, Cornhill, 1813, Fundamental Baptist CD ROM Library, 1701 Harns Rd. If I was wearing a sponge Bob square pants costume while leading worship I would probably be asked to change into something more appropriate. My point is that Tithing is good since Jesus says they should not have left it undone. Just because everyone else is doing it doesnt mean its correct. I love the way David Hayword (aka The nakedpastor) explains some of the problem. Our Pastor teaches that Baptism does not save us and is no a requirement of salvation. May The Lord bless us, and keep us: The Lord make his face shine upon us, and be gracious unto us: The Lord lift up his countenance upon us, and give us peace. Mark 7:7, Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. I would agree with this. Its beginning charter reads as follows: We whose names are hereunder written, being desirous to inhabit ourselves in active and passive obedience to all such orders or agencies as shall be made for the public good of the body in an orderly way, by the major consent of the present inhabitants, masters of families, incorporated together into the same, only in civil things.. It is well to note the Pilgrims were also Puritans, and Puritans were Protestants who had left the Church of England. I know that as I give more to the Lord Im blessed more & even if not I want to. Tithing was never required for anyone except Jews who lived under the Mosaic economy. Historically, Baptists were never a part of the Roman Catholic Church or the Protestant Reformation and therefore can not be correctly called protestors or Protestants. Biblically neither Deacons or Trustees are a governing body, or a board, but titles of special appointed servants who serve at the will of the pastor and congregation. Puritans and Baptists alike, to escape persecution, migrated to the New World. But I also would agree that just about every other Church denomination has strict dress standards as well. For my part, I will continue to preach the Gospel and to teach the Word faithfully. Baptist also believe the Bible interprets itself, and that Christ is the only head of the church. I do not agree with the IFB on their viewpoint of strict dress standards. The line of English churches that can be traced, who called themselves Baptists, began in 1610 in Holland. They were intolerant to anyone who did not agree to the authority of the Puritan church, which was supported by a governmental church tax of all the people. They do not find support in the Bible for such a requirement. If you want to be under law, you need to keep all 613 commandments of the Mosaic law. In determining who were the first Baptists, you must first identify who you are referring to. 3:8-13) are appointed from the local congregation and approved by the majority vote. By 400 AD, the Emperor Theodosius had declared Christianity the only state religion of the Roman Empire. Im looking forward to laughing at more of your comments. First I find your demeaning undertone disheartening. Not once in the New Testament do you find even a hint that a church was legitimate because it was founded by Paul or called itself by a particular name. Whether these groups of believers called themselves Baptists or not, if they were doctrinally pure, following the New Testament for their faith and practice they were New Testament churches and thus they can be called Baptistic. Baptist continued to grow in numbers through the period of the Great Awakening and up to the time of the Revolutionary War. Some formed new churches and called themselves Baptists to make it clear that they believed and followed the New Testament. Fundamental Baptists are strict in interpreting the Bible in a literal sense. In my civilian life..and please do pray for our military..I am very honored to serve as Senior Pastor of Coral Ridge in Jacksonville (FL). It is my conviction that this is contrary to the very foundation of what is a true New Testament church. Catholic Influences on the Modern Translations, 66. Those good Church of Christ folks, I have a few friends in that faith, good folks, but as youve so clearly pointed out, completley out in left field as it relates to musical instruments in the church. In 1638, Williams made his way to what is now Providence, Rhode Island, and there bought some land from the Indians. Seeking to be faithful to the Word of God, the early Bible church movement sought to provide fellowship, counsel, and cooperation. Although they were a great deal more pious than the Church of England they still practiced most of its beliefs including infant baptism. Anyone who differed with the practices of the State church were subject to great persecution. That local body of baptized believers would be as valid a true New Testament church as any church Christ ever founded. I am a musician, so really wouldnt be very content in a church where I couldnt play an instrument and never did go there, except to attend her funeral. It is difficult to document these congregations because they were rarely in the spot light of history. I am divorced, and I always sit in the front rows. It became an independent church in 1746. Hope youll check it out. when the apostle Peter was fishing he stripped and was naked while he was fishing (John 21:7). Using the KJV only is not the problem. Modern church history is irrelevant, not only to our topic but to us in general. I would either be kicked out or asked to put on something to wear. Sir, My question would be: When has anyone ever given 10% to GOD. It more often then none goes to the support building, supplies, salaries of a ministry under the leadership of usually a man., Excellent book on the subject is Should the Church Teach Tithing by Russell Kelly, http://www.truthforfree.com/files/PDF/REK-Tithing3.pdf. From there, entering into an IFB church really gave me a culture shock. Select church size. Will you join us? 6.) If I wanted to wear a sponge bob costume while leading worship I probably would not be allowed to do this in most Churches. The not so fine folks at Westboro Baptist are a bunch of lunatic fringe haters that act in contrast to the love of Christ they espouse to embrace. Advanced Search Directory View All Listings Add Listing Sort By: Grace Baptist Church Pastor's Name Timothy C. Johnson Physical Address 487 Hwy. Most of the Anabaptists successors became the Mennonites, Amish and Quakers. You are truly blind and I hope that you will one day see more clearly. Im sure you realize all this, but I thought I would throw my voice in it. I made a very similar forgiveness plea on facebook just yesterday, asking all to forgive me if I had ever legalistically stepped on them. In 1539 thirty one more who had fled to Holland were apprehended and martyred there. Romans 1:20 says that For since the creation Gods invisible qualities his eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.. 14) before the Lord Jesus announced the coming establishment of the ekklesia. (Matt 16:18). I met him about 25 years ago and our spirits bore witness that we are the sons of God. A church that is a biblical one, patterns its self-after the example in the New Testament. Google Maps shows it located in a modest strip mall in Jacksonville, Florida, alongside an arcade, a . He lived a sinless and exemplary life, died on the cross in our place, and rose again to prove His victory and empower us . These things I write unto you that ye may know that ye have salvation. These are the mistakes one finds when following man-made theology. They say they hold to the NT pattern, and yet, they do not. Baptists, basing their beliefs solely on the Bible, and in particularly the New Testament, have never held to these teachings and see them as heresy. Because of persecution by the Anglican church of all who disagreed with it and who refused to agree to its authority, John Smyth had to flee England. Independent Fundamental Churches of America, fellowship of conservative, independent Christian churches stressing biblical truth. King James (KJV) Independent Fundamental Baptist Churches in Arkansas. - Truth and Song I recently read an article essentially asking this same question, What's Wrong With the Independent Fundamental Baptists? And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. Bob Just want to commend you on how clearly you are able to elucidate on a given topic, Im envious. Its so important to ask Gods help in forgiving themotherwise satan can get a foothold. I thought that this was the passage you were referring to. . Though we no longer keep the ritual and sacramental law, Gods moral laws and prophesies of things yet to come are not to be ignored. She eventually left because my uncle (divorced numerous times himself), rode her case about it. KJV Independent, Fundamental Baptist Churches in the USA . Nope, dont see that. However, tithing has nothing to do with your Salvation ABSOLUTELY we teach tithing if you dont want to give a tenth back to the God that saved your soul from hell, then I wonder if youve met the same God that I have. God bless. He showed me a . Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they Independent Fundamental Churches of America, fellowship of conservative, independent Christian churches stressing biblical truth. The more and more that I looked into it and studied the scripture, I realized not only were they wrong they were *completely* wrong about tithing, in fact, they didnt have a clue, and this was the standard teaching throughout the IFB. Independent Fundamental Baptist churches have fellowship one with the other and often cooperate in such things as evangelism. 2 Timothy 3:16, All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. Examples: Billy Graham, Promise Keepers. 3:1-16) However, some Independent Baptist churches do not accept that the word "officer" is the proper biblical term to be used and particularly does not apply to deacons.

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